The Sports Flow has decided to add some local flavor to the blog. Here in North Dakota, the best rivalry in all of sports is
NDSU (North Dakota State University) Bison vs.
UND (University of North Dakota) Fighting Sioux.
Both schools hate each other with a passion! You could say it's like Duke-UNC (bball), Michigan-Ohio St. (football), or the Yankees-Red Sox... in a North Dakota sense.
But some of it has died down since NDSU's recent move to Division 1. And for the 2008-2009 season UND will begin their transition to Division 1 athletics.
The two schools will renew their rivalry as both will take each other on for the 2008 baseball season. Which could be the first step to the schools playing each other in all sports soon.
But we're not here to just simply talk about the old rivalry. We want to take a deeper look into both school's athletic departments. We'll take an inside look at two different opinions and we'll let you decide for yourself.
Who do you take? NDSU Athletics or UND Athletics?Let the debating begin...
Ming01's take:I may be biased towards NDSU. But I have to take NDSU athletics over UND. UND has some great programs, such as men's hockey, women's basketball, and football is decent. But NDSU has quite a few quality programs and really have adapted to Division 1 well.
Let's start off with NDSU Football. NDSU's football program alone speaks for itself. Personally, if you take the top 2 programs for each. UND Hockey vs NDSU Football. Football has the advantage.
First off, it generates more revenue yearly. NDSU football has it's advantages playing some well known teams in D-1AA and last season just started playing some D-1A teams (Minnesota and Ball St.). They had Minnesota on the ropes in their house (the Metrodome) and dominated the Gophers in every aspect of the game (except FG kicking). The Bison made it look like they were the Big Ten team playing an inferior D-1AA team. And come next year, I expect the same, with the Bison coming out on top.
They've had great success over the last few seasons topping some damn good teams and finished the D-1AA rankings ranked 5th.
Lastly, if you take away NDSU's football program, then you have no athletic department. You can't say the same for hockey.
NDSU's Mens Basketball program has come a long way in the last 4/5 years or so. And I mean a long ways. They own the state of Wisconsin. In 2005-2006 they upset 14th ranked Wisconsin 62-55 and this past season upset 8th ranked Marquette 64-60 at Marquette's home tournament. The one they were suppose to dominate. Holding Dominic James to 3 of 11 FG shooting and 8 points.
In the 2005-2006 season the Bison finished with a 16-12 record and this past season finished at 20-8. Next season they will enter the Mid-Continent Conference and won't be eligible for the NCAA Tournament until the 2008-2009 season; where they will have a legitimate chance of making the big dance with
Ben Woodside,
Mike Nelson,
Luke Moorman,
Brett Winklemann, and their whole bench returning. But next year they have a shot at making the NIT again. I thought they really should have this year, but at the end they had some disappointing losses.
The Bison Men's Basketball team has been impressive in their transition to Division 1 Basketball. They are now entering a conference and should continue to improve. From here on out, I expect this team to compete in the Mid-Con and fight for a NCAA Tournament bid year in and year out.
In my opinion, overall, UND can't top that. There's no comparison, really. NDSU takes it. Joe and I felt like we needed to do a post on NDSU/UND. Plus, we wanted to do something that could generate some great discussion. And lately, I've been in some intense arguments between the two schools with some of my peers.
NDSU is on the rise and have found their place in D-1 athletics. Other than Hockey, UND still needs to adapt when they get to the D-1 level. Just because NDSU has, doesn't mean they will. No one said it's easy. It's a tough transition, and the Bison have payed their dues. There's only one perfect phrase to describe Bison athletics right now, that is... 'Bring on the competition.'
So first and foremost I just want to put out there that Stefan is planning on going to NDSU next year and I am attending UND...readers beware this rivalry may take The Sports Flow by storm and this post may be incredibly biased....With that said here is my take...focusing on both school's main programs.
UND Hockey: is like nothing that NDSU has. Ralph Engelstad Arena in the nicest, most luxurious hockey facility(ies) in NCAA Hockey....maybe in all of Hockey (NHL included). They play at the D1A level...there is nothing higher. In my opinion there is just nothing that NDSU has that can compare, and if you've been to a game you know what I'm talking about. They play on the big stage (played on ESPN2 just a week ago) and are nearly a staple in postseason play and the upper tier of national rankings.
NDSU Football: Sure ok, it's D1AA and grosses more revenue than the hockey team but if you are going to play that card then look...UND is having a bit of an exploratory year in D1AA next year and will be fullblown in '08. So with the whole revenue thing look, in 4-5 years UND will be where NDSU is right now and you can go ahead and add that revenue to what the hockey team does for the university too, so let's just go ahead and about make that a nonfactor.
UND Football: is a relatively top-flight D2 program. They're consistently highly ranked and had a pretty decent
recruiting class this last year. Last season they beat the NIU (Northern Iowa University) Panthers 35-31 in Iowa when the Panthers were the #3 ranked D1-AA team. So really, although the transition won't be easy I don't think it will be terribly hard. So, they've proved they can beat the higher competition and just because they are D2 doesn't mean they can be overlooked. NDSU, yes has a better football program, but UND doesn't lag as far behind as people think. Give them a 3-4 maybe 5 years and we'll have some great rivalry games going on each fall.
NDSU Men's Bball: Is where NDSU gets their main advantage. Sure, they lost Tim Miles, but that might not hurt them too much. I've heard great things about some of the assistants he had over there. With basically all your key players back I think NDSU will have a real shot at making the NIT too....they were about 1 big win away this year.
UND Women's Bball: is probably way too overlooked. They are another top-flight D2 program that should make a nice transition to D1 in coming years. They lost in the Elite 8 this year and are preseasonally ranked #5 for next season. It is worth noting that a lot of people don't even realize that they were 34-1 in the '05-'06.
THE FINAL TAKE
Look, I think that both of these programs collectively are very good and both on the rise. It is almost too close to call and that is why it makes such a good "Take Your Pick", however both out of pride and honesty opinions I'm taking UND.
NDSU's advantage in football is not as large as most think, and whatever advantage they have over UND in Men's Bball the UND Women's team negates, which makes hockey the catalyst here. I think the UND's Hockey program wins this for them (in my mind anyways). It's close and everyone is entitled to their opinion but the bottomline is that NDSU has nothing that compares to UND Hockey....period. You can draw parallels of the program to that of what basketball is to Kentucky or Duke. Top players (i.e. Duncan, Oshie, Chorney, Toews, the list could go on), top facilities (the Ralph is amazing), unbeatable environment (if you haven't been you're missing out), and competition at the highest level of play are just something that NDSU can't offer right now.
It's a tough take and everyone is entitled to their own opinion...so what is your take? Who do you want and why?
w what? We're going to be ready to play."
